Social and political commentary from a conservative perspective

Immigration and a just society

I have been reading the report (pdf) of the Commission on Integration and Cohesion, which was published yesterday. Among other things, it considers the effect of immigration on integration and cohesion.

The report is rather good at laying out the perceptions of integration and cohesion from point of view of the different players in this issue; the settled indigene, the immigrant, the voluntary sector and the State. Considering the dramatis personae in this way led me to thinking about what constitutes a just society.

I took this train of thought because I began to wonder, reading through the report, whether it was at all possible to have a society which all the above players would agree to be ‘just’.

Of course, I know that unanimity is not really possible in these things. What I mean is, is there really, as far as immigration and cohesion are concerned, a framework of rules that can be described, objectively, as ‘just’, regardless of the ‘player’ involved. So can we have a society that is ‘just’ in the eyes of the immigrant, the indigenous Briton, and even the voluntary sector? I exclude the State from consideration in this question, simply on the basis that I assume it, for these purposes, to be ‘outside’ society, in such a way as not to be affected by whether or not the society is a just one.

This train of thought led me to Rawls’s door. John Rawls was a political philosopher who did much thinking on the idea of justice. In particular, he thought a lot about what principles of justice should obtain in a society. Rawls wrote that this could be considered under a setting he called ‘the original position’. Basically, the rules of justice were determined by parties behind a ’veil of ignorance’. Put very simply, the question Rawls postulated was this: ‘what sort of society would you regard as a just one, if you did not know what role you had, or what you would be, in that society?’

So for the purposes of this post, let us try this very simple thought experiment: let us imagine the following people sitting blindfold  around a table: an Eastern European immigrant, an  Englishwoman with roots in  this country going back to the 12th century, a pensioner of limited means, a single parent, and a rich man.

None of these people know what their identities in the society would be, because they are behind the ‘veil of ignorance’. So, for example, someone at the table would have no idea whether he would be the immigrant, the rich man, the pensioner, or the single mother. The task then is this: considering that that they do not know which they would be, what laws would they then create to ensure a just society?

If, for example, someone at the table proposed a law whereby all immigrants were given free housing ahead of single parents and pensioners, and that this was to be paid for by very high taxes, it could backfire on him if he ended up being the rich man, the single parent, or the pensioner. He could only benefit from this law if he were the immigrant. However, the fact that he does not know which he would be in the new society, would force him to think carefully before he proposed such a law.

What the exercise seems to suggest is that there is a point in the middle where all the participants can agree; a consensus ad idem. It suggests that there must be a place where they would all agree that the rich man would not be taxed too much; that the pensioner, immigrant and single parent would be treated fairly according to some agreed criteria; and that whatever accommodation is made for them, it would not be such as to anger the Englishwoman whose family have given their all to this country, and who has never asked anything of the State, but the space to enjoy her country as she remembered it as a child.

So will the Commission’s report find that meeting place? I don’t know yet. I don’t even know that such a meeting place exists. I am still reading the report, and will let you know my views later.

10 Responses to “Immigration and a just society”

  1. Lord Nazh Says:

    In my opinion, there is no such ‘middle ground’.

    As long as you put people into groups, you will have to deal with affecting one group better than another. All laws (by definition, if not practice) are ‘just’, they don’t all make common sense and they don’t all do what they were intended to do, but trying to build a law or concept that treats every group fairly ends up with a law or concept that treats all groups harshly.

  2. dolbyn Says:

    Will consider your points, but i suspect no single law can be taken in issolation and that in reality justness is near impossible to meet on any single law. I suspect without thinking about it properly that all laws taken together can collectivly be equally unjust to all and maybe that is what makes a socient most just, its uniformity of unfairness and bias?

  3. dearieme Says:

    There is (statistically) nobody in this country who has roots here going back to the 12th century who does not have roots here going back many millenia further. Though I don’t suppose that that alters your point.

  4. Lord Nazh Says:

    I have roots there going back to the 12th century and beyond, but I think that’s beside the point too :)

  5. Bel Says:

    Hi dearieme,
    I agree with you. I just picked the 12th century date out of the air. Not having such roots myself, I just wanted to settle on a date that would make my point without ‘ifs’ or ‘buts’. I thought the 12th century went back far enough. Next time, I’ll say something like ‘time immemorial’. :)

  6. dearieme Says:

    I met a chap once who could show me a family grave from the 8th century. In Argyllshire. Not bad, eh? Even more beside the point.

  7. Bel Says:

    8th century family grave, now that is amazing.

    I wonder if any reader can beat that.

  8. Lord Nazh Says:

    I can show you a rock from pre-historic times :)

  9. St Crispin Says:

    Is the century that you & yours hails from “beside the point”? Lets put it another way. You turn up at a new company to start a new job. Do you expect the same rights, remuneration, privaleges & perks as the guys who’s been there 27 years? No you don’t! And when you want to know how something is done in that company, or how to behave in a certain situation, or what the appropriate dress is, do you ask all the others who started on the same day as you, or do you ask someone who’s been there a bit longer, and “knows the score”!

  10. FightBigots Says:

    St Crispin nicely illustrates the point that an analogy is not an argument.

    If a person works in a company for 27 years, they build up knowledge about how to behave in it. A new born baby doesn’t gain any cultural expertise from his ancestry, no matter how
    far back it stretches.

    Culture is something we learn from our environment. My parents may not have been born in this country, but my sense of humour, my attitudes and my values belong to England as much as any other Englishman’s.

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